Tuesday, September 12, 2006
A 9/11 rebuttal
Yesterday on OS (for new readers look on the left in my links section you have to sign up to access the forums tho) someone made a very tasteless post about the politics, people and surrounding patriotism in the face of the 9/11 tragedy. Unfortunately political posts are not allowed at OS and this person's comments were deleted. I had intended to do a direct rebuttal but the comments were erased when I woke up this morning so it's going to have to be a more general conversation.
First of all let me say that i'm not American so my views of American life and social mores may be a bit skewed but I read, watch and listen to enough material that I think I have a pretty damn good idea of the character of the people and the nation. I question the character of the elites but I know in my heart of hearts that the vast majority of Americans are good people of strong character. I would never question them as I know far too many Americans in real life and through the internet. They are just like me, maybe a little more patriotic, a bit more ignorant (maybe that's not the right word but Americans generally say and jump into situations without thinking of future consequences too much so sorry if that kinda offends as it's not meant to be) and more often then not have a far greater sense of adventure and wanting to discover.
I'm going to address the part of the unnamed person's post that I remember the most, basically this person disrespected the singing of "God Bless America" and the whole patriotism bit. While I will agree that it does come across as very egocentric at times there are still ocassions when it's very much valid to do so. These ocassions would be the 9/11 anniversary, Memorial Day and Independence Day. The unnamed poster is allegedly Canadian and when I read his/her complaint on "God Bless America" I had to laugh because for close to 4 centuries the British and their subjects have been singing "God Save the King/Queen"! Unlike the US, that song is actually the national anthem of Great Britain so under this person's naive thinking the British are even more snooty and egotistical then America. :D
Now with the frivolous stuff out of the way we must get deadly serious. The person also claimed that the "terrorists hate freedom and democracy" statement is propaganda on politicians parts. I will agree that it can and has been used from time to time in the last 5 years in that manner but the general tenet of that statement is true, very true. In many ways that statement is not even adequate as it goes far beyond an ideological struggle. Nowadays President Bush has tried to frame the terrorists as religious fascists but it goes beyond that. What we view as militant and extremist islam is actually in the ascendant. If you look at it, most sources will tell you that Islam has over 1.3 BILLION members and according to Howard Bloom there are upwards of 70% of people in the Islamic faith that have views similar in vein of that of the terrorists. That's a staggering number no matter how you slice it.
Now this boils down to my main argument posited by Bloom and others such as Jerome Corsi that this isn't just some ideological battle but one with far reaching implications. If one were to dig into the Koran deeply and read up on Mohammed's teachings you'll see that a main goal of Islam is to convert EVERYONE to that religion. How can this be accomplished? Simply by dehumanizing others to the point that they no longer are deemed to be human. The enemies are infidels and they must be wiped out until they become muslims. In many ways the Islamic faith is one that was birthed through the concept of war to achieve heavenly goals. Now before anyone thinks i'm some bigot or ignorant person I will readily acknowledge that there are strong faith teachings of love and respect in Islam and that my personal religion (Christianity) isn't exactly the nicest religion in the world (just look at the Crusades) but the Islamic faith has a virulent strain of fundamentalist thought these days that needs to be rooted out.
People ask, "why do they hate us" and frankly the answer can be very complicated. I will boil it down to the nuts and bolts of it tho. You see, The Islamic faith for a very long time had the most sophisicated, learned and politically powerful empire in world history. A lot of what we have in the way of antiquity are translations from the Muslim world. It was these people that pushed the young movement of science forward. Of course as the Roman Empire started to grow and the adoption of Christianity came along it was only a matter of time before the encroaching Islamic empire would be attacked by Christianity. This of course led to the famous Crusades and as the centuries came to pass the once bright burning light of Muslim thought and ingenuity started to erode until the end of World War I when the last bastion of the empire was finally destroyed.
This long and tumultous fall from grace created a virulent strain of fundamentalist Islamic faith. The seeds of modern "Jihad" were beginning to form. The faith had become so self loathing and resentful towards the West that it went beyond hating freedom and democracy. They hated the very idea of western thought. Some people where shocked over the Islamic Revolution in Iran under Ayatollah Khomeini but for those who studied what was going on within Islam, it was a logical conclusion to the "persecution" of the West and the Shah of Iran. Khomeini gave the Muslim world a strong and almost too rigid interpretation of the Islamic faith. He and the Revolution created the terrorists that haunt us today.
It is true that Iran is one of the youngest countries demographically and thus the vast majority of the population doesn't have the virulent hatred of the west but in other muslim countries the hatred of America has been passed upon from generation to generation. The hatred of western ideals has grown stronger because of American "occupation" in Iraq and for decades America and Israel has been vilified for stopping the aims of Palestinians and other groups of that ilk.
In short, it's a vicious cycle. Osama Bin Laden just raised the bar with the attack on the World Trade Center and for those who think this will be a relatively quick struggle with Terror then you've got another thing coming. One of the doctrines of fundamental Islam is that they wait...and wait...and wait. They'll be so patient and then strike again. This will be a multi-generational struggle. The west has never thought of warfare in those terms but we will have to. This conflict will be very much like the 100 years war where there were hot spots then a cooling down period and then another hot spot erupting and cooling down again. it didn't help that George W. Bush went into Iraq and created the chaos there as a Saddam led Iraq right now would be a buffer between Iran and Israel. It would be a buffer against those in Iran who are streaming into Iraq and trying to create a fundamentalist Islamic Republic.
In the end, 9/11 wasn't some crazy one off situation. It was the trigger for what will be a long and drawn out war between ideology and religion.
First of all let me say that i'm not American so my views of American life and social mores may be a bit skewed but I read, watch and listen to enough material that I think I have a pretty damn good idea of the character of the people and the nation. I question the character of the elites but I know in my heart of hearts that the vast majority of Americans are good people of strong character. I would never question them as I know far too many Americans in real life and through the internet. They are just like me, maybe a little more patriotic, a bit more ignorant (maybe that's not the right word but Americans generally say and jump into situations without thinking of future consequences too much so sorry if that kinda offends as it's not meant to be) and more often then not have a far greater sense of adventure and wanting to discover.
I'm going to address the part of the unnamed person's post that I remember the most, basically this person disrespected the singing of "God Bless America" and the whole patriotism bit. While I will agree that it does come across as very egocentric at times there are still ocassions when it's very much valid to do so. These ocassions would be the 9/11 anniversary, Memorial Day and Independence Day. The unnamed poster is allegedly Canadian and when I read his/her complaint on "God Bless America" I had to laugh because for close to 4 centuries the British and their subjects have been singing "God Save the King/Queen"! Unlike the US, that song is actually the national anthem of Great Britain so under this person's naive thinking the British are even more snooty and egotistical then America. :D
Now with the frivolous stuff out of the way we must get deadly serious. The person also claimed that the "terrorists hate freedom and democracy" statement is propaganda on politicians parts. I will agree that it can and has been used from time to time in the last 5 years in that manner but the general tenet of that statement is true, very true. In many ways that statement is not even adequate as it goes far beyond an ideological struggle. Nowadays President Bush has tried to frame the terrorists as religious fascists but it goes beyond that. What we view as militant and extremist islam is actually in the ascendant. If you look at it, most sources will tell you that Islam has over 1.3 BILLION members and according to Howard Bloom there are upwards of 70% of people in the Islamic faith that have views similar in vein of that of the terrorists. That's a staggering number no matter how you slice it.
Now this boils down to my main argument posited by Bloom and others such as Jerome Corsi that this isn't just some ideological battle but one with far reaching implications. If one were to dig into the Koran deeply and read up on Mohammed's teachings you'll see that a main goal of Islam is to convert EVERYONE to that religion. How can this be accomplished? Simply by dehumanizing others to the point that they no longer are deemed to be human. The enemies are infidels and they must be wiped out until they become muslims. In many ways the Islamic faith is one that was birthed through the concept of war to achieve heavenly goals. Now before anyone thinks i'm some bigot or ignorant person I will readily acknowledge that there are strong faith teachings of love and respect in Islam and that my personal religion (Christianity) isn't exactly the nicest religion in the world (just look at the Crusades) but the Islamic faith has a virulent strain of fundamentalist thought these days that needs to be rooted out.
People ask, "why do they hate us" and frankly the answer can be very complicated. I will boil it down to the nuts and bolts of it tho. You see, The Islamic faith for a very long time had the most sophisicated, learned and politically powerful empire in world history. A lot of what we have in the way of antiquity are translations from the Muslim world. It was these people that pushed the young movement of science forward. Of course as the Roman Empire started to grow and the adoption of Christianity came along it was only a matter of time before the encroaching Islamic empire would be attacked by Christianity. This of course led to the famous Crusades and as the centuries came to pass the once bright burning light of Muslim thought and ingenuity started to erode until the end of World War I when the last bastion of the empire was finally destroyed.
This long and tumultous fall from grace created a virulent strain of fundamentalist Islamic faith. The seeds of modern "Jihad" were beginning to form. The faith had become so self loathing and resentful towards the West that it went beyond hating freedom and democracy. They hated the very idea of western thought. Some people where shocked over the Islamic Revolution in Iran under Ayatollah Khomeini but for those who studied what was going on within Islam, it was a logical conclusion to the "persecution" of the West and the Shah of Iran. Khomeini gave the Muslim world a strong and almost too rigid interpretation of the Islamic faith. He and the Revolution created the terrorists that haunt us today.
It is true that Iran is one of the youngest countries demographically and thus the vast majority of the population doesn't have the virulent hatred of the west but in other muslim countries the hatred of America has been passed upon from generation to generation. The hatred of western ideals has grown stronger because of American "occupation" in Iraq and for decades America and Israel has been vilified for stopping the aims of Palestinians and other groups of that ilk.
In short, it's a vicious cycle. Osama Bin Laden just raised the bar with the attack on the World Trade Center and for those who think this will be a relatively quick struggle with Terror then you've got another thing coming. One of the doctrines of fundamental Islam is that they wait...and wait...and wait. They'll be so patient and then strike again. This will be a multi-generational struggle. The west has never thought of warfare in those terms but we will have to. This conflict will be very much like the 100 years war where there were hot spots then a cooling down period and then another hot spot erupting and cooling down again. it didn't help that George W. Bush went into Iraq and created the chaos there as a Saddam led Iraq right now would be a buffer between Iran and Israel. It would be a buffer against those in Iran who are streaming into Iraq and trying to create a fundamentalist Islamic Republic.
In the end, 9/11 wasn't some crazy one off situation. It was the trigger for what will be a long and drawn out war between ideology and religion.
# posted by Chris Fung @ 10:52 AM 
